Lay off meat eating Hindus…PLEASE
“How can you call yourself a Hindu?…YOU EAT MEAT!!!” I heard two Hindu boys yelling at a girl in a recent event at City University Hindu Society. The discussion was supposed to be on the subject of “Karma and Reincarnation”, and hence quite unrelated to an individual’s dietary habits. But somehow the discussion had sidetracked onto whether a non-vegetarian person can consider him or herself to be a good Hindu…
April 29th, 2007 at 9:37 pm
If we do not comment on these false-Hindu’s and their meat eating, OUR SILENCE IS OUR GUILT. Jai Shree Ram
April 29th, 2007 at 10:14 pm
Although there are many different sects within hinduism, one of the fundamental principles is that of non - violence. How that is observed is up to the individual…
April 29th, 2007 at 10:17 pm
For once an intellectual post, good post. I totally agree with you cannot judge a person by there dietary habits!..Remember , Hitler was a vegetarian! so go figure!
April 29th, 2007 at 10:30 pm
I agree that being a rude fanatic is deplorable, and that many substitute a smug self-satisfaction in their beliefs and practices for a real striving to come to an awareness of what the beliefs and practices should produce: inner Realization. Yet vegetarianism is a prime support to that striving, and Hindus should not be ashamed of spreading the word about the benefits of all aspects of vegetarianism, without, of course, ruining that “evangelization” with a brutal one-upmanship. Leave the brutality to the meat eaters.
A good article on Vegetarianism is “Spiritual Benefits of a Vegetarian Diet” at:
http://www.atmajyoti.org/sw_spir_benefits_veg_diet.asp
April 29th, 2007 at 10:45 pm
I personally eat meat and I am a HINDU, I was vegie for the first 13 years of my life. I feel that eatting meat does not make me any less of a hindu then any one else on this forum.
From personal experiences I have seen many of my friends of whom are hindu that do not eat meat, lack knowledge about the religion and are only vegie due to the fact that they have been bought up that way and don’t actually know why the shouldn’t eat meat. Im not saying that all vegie hindu’s are like this. But I believe that eating meat does not make you any less of a hindu then vegie hindu and that you shouldn’t be judged upon this.
April 30th, 2007 at 4:16 am
I do not believe that there is even one religiouse person on this earth who follows every thing good advocated bu their religion.
Fact of the matter is that it is proven that eating meat is non natural, violent and ethical and spiritually does not seem right. What we eat is what we are, is a common and proven proverb.
As far as karma is concerned we are free to do what we want but we need to remember that eventually we will have to face the consequencies of our actions.
It is up to individual to decide what they want to do that is against their religiouse doctrines. They may decide to kill, consume alcohol, eat meat, womanise etc. They may even try to provide some sort of good reasons, excuses etc to justify it but the fact is they should be ready to face the consequencies, in all sense, physical, mental and spiritual.
Doing two right things does not justify doing one wrong thing.
pls think about it with clear mind, No offence intended to any body.
April 30th, 2007 at 5:09 am
Bengali Hindus,assamese Hindus,Nepalese Hindus,Sarawat and kahsmiri Brahmins,Punjabi Hindus(non Brahmins) and many many other Hindus have been taking meat and fish since ages.
If nonveg eating means one is non Hindu then more than 405 present Indian Hindus are non Hindus. if u insist on this defintion, I a Bengali Hindu,who stay in India would say these “I dont care”. Who r u to have the copy right on the definition of Hindu? U may give urself this right, i dont give a damn to you. U like to call me an infidel, a non Hindu, go ahead. Call me something else, I dont care. I am otherwise probably a far more practising Hindu than u guys! I medidate, do
gayatri mantra, attend pujas,do yoga, help RSS and much more. See Boss, I dont who u r . Dont type to bully non veg Hndus into ur type of Hinduism. If that means ,we r having different religions, let it be.
Now, a little polite talk. Listen, I and we all nonveg Hindus accept ur fundamental beliefs. That, non veg is really Sattwic and non veg is tamasic or Rajasic. For Brahmachary or for yogis, eating Sattwic food helps. But, then, I am neither Satteic nor Rajasic. Nor ,I think u r even if u consider urself to be. And, to go to sattwic nature, i need first of all to get rid of my extreme Tamas,which plague Indian Hindus(veg and non veg ). And,yoga says meat eating will make us
more rajasic and then when we r more strong,brave,confident and active, we will slowly turn veg and saatwic. We all agree that veg eating is more adorable and more civilised but dont try to force a single medicine through everyone’s throat! For that matter, even ahimsa is more civilised,more sattwic and more close to Yoga. But,why in Gita,Krishna asks Arjun to kill people! U have to understand this.
U dont agree with me ? Fine, I also dont agree with u. What next? Wanna fight? come. I will also fight. U say i a non Hindu? As i sais, I give a damn to ur comments. I go to hell? OK. And,u go to hell too!!
April 30th, 2007 at 6:28 am
Of course, the “holier-then-thou” routine if not something anyone should employ, people are not looking to be judged, and anyone following a principle e.g. vegetarianism, should not condemn those who are not.
One of the core principles of Hinduism is compassion (note this is very different from non-violence), then surely being Vegetarian is simply a matter of not inflicting unnecessary pain on other creatures just because we like the taste.
Ultimately, we all have our free will, however we should not justify such infliction of pain on other creatures, as anything “Hindu”, and despite it certainly not being something that is advocated by the Ancient Vedas of India - which are the scriptures that define what “Hindu” really is, we have made a personal choice to be un-compassionate.
April 30th, 2007 at 8:04 am
I have eaten meat all my life…..all forms of meat except beef. One year ago i decided to give up , this was due to worshipping deities in my home, i have become more aware of meat and the dirt and low level of this food consumption.
Our bodies do not need meat! we have been given such good fruit and veg by our gods ….why do we need meat?
spiritually we are cleaner , minds our higher level , i feel personally better with alot more energy and mind is focused.
If we eat meat we contribute to the massacres of killings …we contribute to mass torture of animals..we contirbute to evil non discriminate killing of innocent animals..we contribute to breeding of animals to slaughter..we contribute to abhorrent mass killings of animals for food and skins..we contribute to a food chain desined to satisfy our own needs, we contribute to evil against our deities who show no mercy for these crimes against our own gods…..our gods are animala as well have you forgotton?????
yes i have eaten meat …..but have now seen the light ..i serve my lords with veggie food , then servce others , then feed myself……Please see the light , you will achieve nothing from lustful eating of meats that will not reward you……meat is the love for a gluttuney…..veggie is love for spiritual gain and love of our hindu, jain, buddhist philosophies.
jai shaka hari ki
April 30th, 2007 at 8:36 am
Namaskar,
Congratulations to Shri Patel for his well-thought piece of writing. Shri Patel is right when he said that a man cannot be judged purely by his dietary habits. Even though I support ‘vegetarianism’, I fully agree with Shri Patel’s thinking that you cannot judge a man by the food he eats. One can very much be a good Hindu despite being a non-vegetarian.
(M.P. Balakrishnan)
April 30th, 2007 at 8:53 am
When ever the subject of Hinuism comes up some fanatical minded (Hindu talibans) humans who call themselves better Hindus than the rest open their mouths without a thought. Hinduism is not something that belongs to one group of people. Across length and bredth of India live hundreds of thousands of different races who ones used to be hunter gatherers and have maintained their eating habits for eons. Vegetarianism came into practice on a much later date as thinkers of those times and the evolving religions of “A” particular area instilled their philosophies into the minds of communties that lived in those times and became adherent followers of that system. Hinduism has always been and always will be a belief system of multiples, no one group has an authority on it . Implying non-vegetetians and suggesting that they are lesser Hindus is naive and sheer arrogance. I would like to say to those who see non-vegetetians differently, that they are as brain washed as the followers of other faiths who like to dictate and impose their faiths and belief systems on others and vis-a-vis. Lastly if those vegeterians who think that meat eating is so devilish a practice why on earth have they come to make their living in an ASUR land? The money they handle day in day out has passed through a butchers , fish mongers shop and god knows how many meat eating devils who eat beef ( worthy of a massive demonstration is it not ?). Greatness of Hinduism lies in its philosophies and liberty that it gives to an individual to preach and practice the way he chooses to and not being dictated upon. That is Sanatam Dharma ( universal Dharma ) the true democratic faith and nothing less the way i always put it . Jai Shree Krishna .
April 30th, 2007 at 9:39 am
this article sounds as though it actually condones meat eating!
Readers who are facing a dilema on wehter to stay vegetarian are going to think its fine to eat meat and guess what…ITS NOT!
April 30th, 2007 at 10:34 am
Aum Tat Sat.
If you eat meat and eat it only for sustenance of the body, and not for the taste then you neither enjoy its fruits or hold it in more value than other foods?. If you enjoy the meats and their tastes and are unable to control the desire then you can say that you do not hold full control of your senses. We all have weaknesses in different ways and areas, but our goal is to overcome every aspect of our senses , were we become one with everything at one time and are able to see through the great illusion (maya)its not easy. One who eats meat and enjoys it is no different to one who loves and enjoys his car trapped in this world by his senses. In conclusion its all relative. Jai Shri Ram.
April 30th, 2007 at 10:39 am
I think vegetarianism is a required tenet of Jainism while Hindus have now internalised the concept.
I know for a fact that many brahmin communities too consume meat –esp those that live in coastal areas….
I believe even the Valmiki Ramayana makes reference to meat eating …….?
I’m a vegetarian myself –can’t bear to even look at a show on TV cooking meat ,but I think it is only right that one should not shove down anothers throat, one’s views .
I guess it comes down to this–one man’s food another man’s poison.
Best wishes
_CS
April 30th, 2007 at 10:59 am
Nitin Mehta
One reason why Hinduism is not taken seriously is that the perception is that there are NO rules in Hinduism–you can do what you like and be a Hindu. Those Hindus who eat meat are born Hindus -not practicing Hindus. The author of the article found the meat eater more composed and somehow that made it OK. There is nothing composed about the chicken which is subjected to utter most cruelty before you consume it. Compassion and Ahimsa are the solid pillars on which Hinduism stands—this is what sets us apart from othe religions–compassion towards all living beings. Take away vegetariansim -and there is not much difference between Hinduism and other religions. Vegetarianism is the greatest gift of Hinduism to the world. Meat is the cause of massive damage to our planet, it the cause of many diseases and it is taking away food from the hungry. Almost 4 billion people could be fed by the amount of grains fed to animals. Almost 90% of worlds water resources are used up in meat production–a criminal waste in a already thirsty world. From Ram to Krishna to Shiva to the Pandavas there is no mention of meat eating. Those Hindus who cant give up the taste of animal flesh–please do NOT use Hinduism as an excuse to continue meat eating. What is it about Sanatan Dharma that it has survived for millions of years–when other civilisations have come and disappeared with the passing of time–it is Ahimsa—god protects those who protect others. This Ahimsa is the Ahimsa of the brave not cowerds. It does not mean that you do not fight your opperssors–it means that from a ant to elephant –you go out of your way not to harm. The McDonalds of this world want the billion Hindus to develop a taste for meat–they want to change the most fundamental belief of Hindus—this is the biggest attack on the survival of Hinduism –this is simply not a matter of personal choice—there is much more at stake here–we in the West should set an example to Hindus of India that no matter how much you progress–our Sattvic diet is so important that it should be defended with great zeal. There ar over 5 milliom English people who are vegetarian–many of whom are attracted to Hinduism because of its Ahimsa–we need to reach out to them by introducuing them to the delights of Indian vegetarian food. There are English people who run animal sanctuaries–looking after cows and other animals–we should be giving them moral and material support—it is no use keeping our Hinduism to ourselves—-Vegetariansm is that vehicle through which we can reach out to others and it is a badge of honour every Hindu should wear.
Nitin Mehta
April 30th, 2007 at 11:44 am
Meat is from a living thing, so are plants they too have and had life and its cut (killed) then washed and cooked, so in short a hindu is not a hindu if he or she has even eaten a plant as it was living too. Think
You cannot out caste some one only by what they eat, i am a Bramin and i eat meat so does that outcaste me too!!!!!!
Beef is out as its counted as a mother :- beacuse it gives milk and also takes 9 mths to bear a calf…. thats why!!!
April 30th, 2007 at 1:01 pm
A lot of the responses of the people who are vegetarian seem very judgmental and therefore un-hindu-like to me.
For example the point made by “ReddyK” starts very articulate and understanding, however this is completely contradicted by the statement “Leave the brutality to the meat eaters.”.
Can we please discuss things in a more civillised manner?
April 30th, 2007 at 1:49 pm
Do you want to see the effect of meat eating? Read Gautam’s post above. Wow! Is that the type of mind anyone wants? Not me!
April 30th, 2007 at 2:06 pm
Dear Brothers and Sisters,
In the 17th chapter of Bhagvad Geeta, the definitions of sattvik, rajasik and tamasik foods are given in verses 8, 9 and 10 respectively. The food we take has been classified according to their quality and not content. Nowhere it has been mentioned that meat is forbidden. Of course beef is forbidden in the Atharva Veda.
Lord Rama, during his exile of 14 years was a regular consumer of pork. This is written in Valmiki Ramayana. Lord Buddha’s last meal was pork. Guru Govind Singh advised Hindus to stop take Halal meat (meat of animal killed according to Islamic or Jewish Laws) and used to say that those Hindus who haven’t eaten pork are not Hindus at all.
In Bengal, most people are worshippers of Shakti. And in worship of Shakti, sacrifice is a must (though it has been banned by secular government). In Bengal it is a custom to consume the sacrificial meat of the male goat as prasad of Shakti worship.
So friends, please don’t feel guilty in consuming meat (except beef). Be LIONS and not LAMBS.
Thanks and regards,
Kalyan Sarkar
April 30th, 2007 at 4:06 pm
i disagree - that’s like telling a jew that it’s ok to eat pork eventhough mosaic law says a hebrew must not eat pork.
i agree that the method the vegetarians took against the girl is wrong. you don’t convince someone of your point by bullying them. but the principle is right - krishna says if you eat animal flesh the animal has a right to come back and slaughter you. even if not through reincarnation karma will come back to you via health problems (such as with my family all of whom eat a lot of meat and have had bypass surgery or take medications to lower their cholesterol).
p.s. it’s ironic how the UN says meat consumption is the LARGEST contributor to global warming - more so than cars!! - and yet here we have a bunch of hindus saying its ok to hurt god’s creation to satisfy your taste for animal flesh
April 30th, 2007 at 4:22 pm
I am a Hindu yet i eat meat… To eat meat doesnt mean i am any less of a Hindu. On religous occasions or months, i do not eat meat, but when the hindu calender doesn’t have anything religious in it. To eat the meat is not wrong, because every indiviual here even the bhramins have atleast one rule they dont follow or belief they dont believe. The rule we chose not to follow was the meat eating rule… nd i dont see anything wrong in it. I am a Hindu because i follow important rules like not eating beef specifically. I have not touched beef in my life, and there is nothing wrong in it. The girl was victimized for no reason at all. it wasnt fair what those boys did.
April 30th, 2007 at 4:24 pm
I think that the most important thing is that Hinduism is against is any sort of fascism which unfortunately I’m seeing displayed by the veggie fascists here . Vegetarianism may be a high ideal but not everyone can follow all high ideals and Hindus in the past just like now have always eaten meat. During the Buddhist and Jain periods maybe many Hindus did take up vegetarianism which then was taken up by the Vaishnavas as part of their beliefs .But that doesn’t mean its law for all Hindus .Shivaji and many other great Hindu warriors ate meat and they’re probably some of the greatest Hindus in our history. So let’s not confuse the rules and regulations which are set for Gurus and Sadhus as also for the mainstream Hindu society because its not written anywhere. Also I see many Gujuratis having an issue with other Hindus eating meat because that’s because they’re influenced by their cultural environment they are from but being a Punjabi myself I’m not going to have anyone’s cultural imperialism be pushed on me.Thanks
April 30th, 2007 at 4:43 pm
Anon if suicidal non violence was a principal then Hindus and dharma wouldn’t be here. Hindus faught for dharma thats why we r still around. Besides ahimsa in most cases is just an excuse for COWARDICE. I think i am going to go and enjoy my goat curry now. so good.
April 30th, 2007 at 4:45 pm
Shiv Das,
The only false hindus are you that make up stupidity about Ahimsa and Hindus not eating meat. We all know that most Hindus eat meat. They also were the ones that mostly likely go out on the streets and defend dharma. Then the likes of you which hide behind the puja and pray to have someone else save your behind.
April 30th, 2007 at 5:43 pm
As a strict vegetarian myself, my own view is that this, like many other such matters, is a personal question, for each individual to decide for themselves; however, if I might share a little story purely for interest..
I consider myself extremely fortunate to have been able to spend some time working with (actually, more like learning from) a certain highly respected RSS worker in Bharat, who originally hails from West Bengal. Whilst he is a devout and conscientious Hindu, he does nevertheless eat meat (after reciting bhojan mantra, of course!). When I asked him about this, he replied very simply, “Hum Bengal ke hein; hamaare yahaan to Bhagwaan tak bhi maas khaataa he, to hum kyaa cheez hein?!”
April 30th, 2007 at 5:50 pm
Sanathan Dharma requires us to see and revere the same Divine Brahman in all living entities from the human being to the smallest ant. The same atman in me and you resides in every other living entity too. Killing animals to consume its flesh for our selfish desires is cruel and barbaric and goes completely against the tenets of Hindu Dharma. It also prevents spiitual progression. The shaastras state “non-violence is the highest Truth”. now I don’t beleive in absolute non-violence, but killing helpless animals and turning our stomachs into a graveyard is Adharmic, and unnecessary in a country like UK where there is sufficient alternatives available to fill our stomachs. In the Mahabharata, it is stated that “one who augments their self through the flesh of animals lives in misery”. It can also safely be said that meat is a “tamasic” food that polutes our body and hence mind, and should be avoided. Eskimos have little choice, but in this country we have plenty so there isn’t a way we can justify our weaknesses and lack of self-control.
April 30th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
It’s ridiculous how meat eaters misinerpret respect for animals (which is the basis of the teachings of our scriptures) with cowardice? Killing defenceless animals in battery farms and abbatoirs represents bravery does it?
April 30th, 2007 at 6:14 pm
I would send those who claim all non vegiterian hindus as non Hindus to the abbatoir.
April 30th, 2007 at 7:05 pm
How can you say that because we eat meat that we have less hinduism within us. Its not about what we consume, or what we get our energy from. It was said in the Ramayan, Ram had eaten buffalo’s whilst living in the wild. If our respected can do so, why can’t us minors do so? Killing defenceless animal’s is beside the point, their blood doesn’t lie in our hands, we are pure handed. Repsenting bravery, that is beside the point. Bravery is not the key to this. We are not proven brave for eating meat! Those who disown their own, for eating meat, you need to think, what your doing is it right? those you disown today, will be the ones you will need tommrow!
April 30th, 2007 at 7:45 pm
“Sanathan Dharma requires us to see and revere the same Divine Brahman in all living entities from the human being to the smallest ant. The same atman in me and you resides in every other living entity too”
Yeh but doesn’t that same divine Brahman also dwell in plants ? Dont tell me that’ss allowed in Shastra so its ok.Hindu philosophy encourages logic then just blind faith.You cant just tell people that can’t eat meat because its un-Hindu to do so.
April 30th, 2007 at 8:43 pm
i agree with reena….am a hindu…an am not a vegitarian but recently have converted into a vegitarian, but thats only because my boyfriend is a Brahman-Guji and i am a hindu-bengali girl, so therefore there is alot o difference in my culture, and his..but he has been teaching me the awareness of hindiusm, though am not very religious.
April 30th, 2007 at 10:50 pm
No one in this world can say to someone if they are a good hindu or not. remember onli god can judge you… and for the 2 guys that were judging the girl for eating meat, they cant, beacuse am pretty sure everyone done bad in their life… who are they to say to that girl, she bad for eating meat? dont judge people…………….
April 30th, 2007 at 11:16 pm
Nitin Mehta - you do more harm than good with your one sided and extreme arguments. Hinduism as a whole can never have rules and regulations, and if you would like it to, then you are going to remain dissapointed. Rules and regulations are not good for all people, they create an imbalanced emphasis on relatively external things about religion, to the expense of the internal and subjective transformation that true religion aims for.
May 1st, 2007 at 8:23 am
I read the article and felt like the writer was saying something which always used to occur in my mind ,but hadn’t been channelised before.
I am a hard core vegetarian ,but still feel, there is room for nonvegetarianism in the pale of hinduism.
It is because of these veg fascist we have commies and other veg fanatics trying to change or stop sacrifices in temples etc. They don’t know the import of the karma(pooja) nor they want to know.
They just want to score some brownie infront of commies and non hindus or may be isckon variety.A question what do these bigots wear to protect their feet, padukas(wooden) or leather wear.
It is because of these veg fanatics we (read hindus) are being turned out into absolute ‘emasculates’.
If these veg fanatics have their way,they may have only veg food in army canteens.
so much for votaries of hinduism.
Straitjacketing Hinduism won’t help the cause of Hinduism
May 1st, 2007 at 8:31 am
Having read Mr Patels ariticle, one thing stands out…….this is not about hinduism, reliogion, or personal beleifs. Its about the suffering of animals and its abou moral values……putting it simply, meat eaters have no moral velaues.
May 1st, 2007 at 8:40 am
Eating meat is not the biggest sin in Hinduism , not knowing why you eat the Meat is !!!!
You eat meat to satisfy your thirst for greed, greed for flesh, flesh of innocent animals . eating meat is not mother of all crimes although Hindu, Jain , Buddhist and Sikh philosophy teaches meat eating is WRONG ……we eat meat to help the economy of the West and especially Mcdonalds.
In all above mentioned religions people will eat meat and justify through some means …..killing of a living being is forbidden in all eastern religions and we still do this!!!!!
If you want cleanse your body then give up meat fellow Hindu’s …..be better Hindu’s …..become spiritually cleaner …..you will not miss meat …i promise you …meat is like Lust , Anger , Frustration and Toxic Poison that will consume you by disease and mental torture …..look at You on a Friday night after pub in the kebab shop !!!!!!!!!!!!!
jai Shaka hari ki jai
May 1st, 2007 at 9:07 am
I will not enter the general debate, as this will go on for ages (as it has done in the past) and people end up saying the same points repetitively. However on a narrower point: Ram ate a Buffalo? I really dislike it when people make up stories, to justify their own habits. “It was said in the Ramayan”, well I think this is a case of how over time people have twisted the likes of the Ramayan and Mahabharat to justify their own actions. Are you doing the same old chap? Please don’t taint the Ramayan, and especially Shree Ram with such nonsense.
Jai Bajrang Bali!
May 1st, 2007 at 10:30 am
Alot of “wannabe” Hindus seem to be cropping up on thois site, well listen to this…you claim that nowhere does it say that consuming meat is a sin…but then again In the Ramamyan it also says that the Rakhshas army of Ravana kept belittling the sadhus by pouring meat onto the havan(fire) and therfore making a mockery of it, it also never mentions Shri Ram or any of the opther pious characters eating meat at all, someone earlier said that Ram ate pork in the forst…total B.S! Ram, Lakhshman and Sita ate only nuts, berries, fruits….the only character to be mentioned eating emat was Ravan himself!! and his scary looking band of Rakshas’ but if you “wannabe” Hindus want to follow in their path then thats upto you, but nobody in their right mind looks upto Ravana, and all you meat eaters out there using Hindusim as their front are gravely mistaken, and will be punished severly.We are a faith that belives in Karma, do something bad(eat meat) and the reseults will come back to haunt you.
May 1st, 2007 at 10:47 am
I agree with Sanjay’s comment. It is about Moral Values! and not to do with Religion etc… At the end of it, It’s Animals that suffer from the hands of meat eater’s… I also agree that Meat eater’s have absolutly No Moral Values whatsoever. Murdering animals, is so wrong!
May 1st, 2007 at 11:17 am
Namaste
Oh what a controversial subject U have chosen. But that is the beauty,asno subject is a No Go area for HV.
Although I am a vegetarian and proud of it, I feel we should never consider ourselves better, superior in any way or look down on others who eat mea.
It has been proved beyond any doubt that vegetarianism is a better, healthier life style, dietary habit provided we eat sensibly, with lots of vegis, fruits, lentils and dairy products. Some even consider eggs as vegis, as these eggs are non fertile, incapable of hatching.
The longest living animals are all vegetarians and that include elephants, tortoise and even whales who survive on tiny planktons. Their life span is from 50 to 200 years.
The tortoise on galapagos Islands live, on average 125 years and the one Captain Cook rode there in 1769 died in Sidney Zoo recently.
It is wrong to be judgemental, adopt holier than thou attitude, as some writers have done. We the Hindus are already divided on caste, creed, cupture, social and ethnic background. Surelu we don’t want to add dietary habit as one more factor in this scenario.
India is a vast country with many contradictions. It is Hinduism that keeps us togethet if not united, as we all know how inclusive our religion is.
It is kind, considerate, accommodating and liberal, in fact too liberal for our own good. Most Hindus in Kerala, Tamil nadu, bengal, Panjab, Nepal eat meat.
In fact Gujarat is the only one that is predominanently meat free, perhaps due to Gandhi influence. But even Gujarat is also changing fast.
I believe that we the vegetarians should try to potray ourselves but without aggressive attitude to others. We can spread the message without being overbearing or looking down on others.
The truth is on our side and inthe end it wii triumph.
Bhupendra
May 1st, 2007 at 11:39 am
“putting it simply, meat eaters have no moral velaues. ”
Yeh right this is a new one .So people who eat meat have no moral values and people like Hitler who was a veggie had moral values ?
May 1st, 2007 at 11:43 am
“If you want cleanse your body then give up meat fellow Hindu’s …..be better Hindu’s …..become spiritually cleaner …..you will not miss meat …i promise you …meat is like Lust , Anger , Frustration and Toxic Poison that will consume you by disease and mental torture …..look at You on a Friday night after pub in the kebab shop !!!!!!!!!!!!!”
Ravi I dont believe you ever ate meat at all if you’re coming out with this type of nonsense unless you’re trying to put your own personal guilt on others.I do go to the kebab shop but dont go to the pub because I dont drink.
May 1st, 2007 at 11:48 am
“In the Ramamyan it also says that the Rakhshas army of Ravana kept belittling the sadhus by pouring meat onto the havan(fire) and therfore making a mockery of it, ”
Yeh but which meat eating Hindu is going to do a barbacue over a Havan ? That scene you’re talking about is evil people and not meateaters.Like I said before none you lot of you would even be Hindus if it wasn’t to someone like Shivaji who was a meateater unless you think he wasn’t a good Hindu either.
May 1st, 2007 at 12:36 pm
The only wannabe Hindu here seems to be Dharmesh Agravat with his elitist nonsense about driving taxis and his snobbish attitude, first of all he doesn’t seem to know that Ramayana has more significance to a Vaishnava than to someone who is a Shaiva, different communities have different rules regarding meat eating.
The only wannabe Hindus here are all these veggie fascist cyber warriors (no offense to decent vegetarians like Dangerous or Satya) who wouldn’t even be Hindu in the first place if not for meat eaters like Baji Rao and other Hindu Veers.
I guess these lot have never heard of the story of Dharmavyadha (yep its in the Mahabharata), please go look it up.
May 1st, 2007 at 12:59 pm
From Nitin Mehta
If one does not pratice a religion it is only a label. All this talk of not being judgemental and not further dividing Hindus is nonsense. Christians and Muslims convert Hindus by saying that a religion that has no rules is a joke. We want a Hinduism without any annoying rules. It is no use saying that truth will truimph and we should not try and be holier then thou. While we make such self congratulatary statements–the meat lobby is busy trying to get all Hindus to eat meat. We are a laughing stock. If we dont speak up NOW then who will? The only thing that sets us apart from other religions is Ahimsa and compassion towards all living beings. Some claim only Sadhus have to be vegetarian! Are not Sadhus our spiritual guides? We are supposed to follow their teachings—but as I said we do not like any inconviniencies with our Hinduism ! Some even claim that they are the brave ones who have kept Hinduism alive because of their meat eating!! Now where is the bravery in eating a chicken or a goat? And how many of these brave meat eaters could kill with their hands a chicken or a goat? Some desperately say that because we eat vegetables we can eat meat too! They suddenly develop compassion for vegetables! They see no difference between harvesting rice and killing a animal with all the senses the humans have. Some one mentioned RSS pracharak eating meat because he was Bengali—well even Rabindranath Tagore was Bengali and so was Srila Prabhupad the founder of ISKON-they did not justify meat eating because they were Bengali— I was shocked to find out that Ashok Chougle the vice president of VHP eats meat. And yet we claim loftily we do not eat Beef –so is there no life in other animals? Gandhi said that a Hindu who protects a cow should protect all animals–a cow is but an example of our relationship with animals. At the end of the day to sustain this taste of animal flesh–people are desperately trying to bend the scriptures and other ‘great thinkers’ want us to keep quiet about promoting vegetariansm–they even call us fascists–well if we are fascists then so was Krishna, Gurur Nanak Dev, Dayanand Saraswati, Sai Baba, Swami Ramdev, Tolstoy, Pythagoras, Plato, George Bernard Shaw and millions of others–and I suppose those who eat and kill 55 billion animals a year are angels! I repeat the biggest danger to Hinduism is meat eating and animal slaughter—-the blood of animals will destroy this Sanatan Dharma– beacuse the Karma reactions will be terrible. By protecting the animals and being vegetarian we are doing our heritage a great favour. So those who pass moral judgements like ‘ everyone according to their preference’–are sigularly failing in giving our children and others the most basic ‘Sanskar’ of not eating animal flesh. Though it might offend some it is time to stop sitting on the fence. Ask anyone who says he is a Hindu if he is a vegetarian– if not explain the importance of being one.
Nitin Mehta
May 1st, 2007 at 6:20 pm
Plants do not have a brain, nor nerve endings (this has been scientifically proven) so DO NOT EXPERIENCE pain. I hate the way weak-minded Hindus state “Hinduism doesn’t forbid anything”. No it doesn’t but it IS a way of life and to claim it doesn’t impact on ethics is ridiculous. Hinduism doesn’t expressly forbid paedophilia (i know this is an extreme example), but does that mean these nonces are not acting against Dharma? Our scriptures discuss the principles of life, Brahman, creation and atman. It doesn’t tell you what to do; but there are certain actions that contravene this principles. A Hindu is one who seeks the Truth; seeking that Truth requires control over the mind and senses as well as living life in a certain way. Killing animals and eating their flesh goes against the ethos of Sanathan Dharma.
One who becomes addicted to sense gratification falls into the foulest of hells. There is no excuse to eat meat except a) ignorance and b) weakness. All living entities have the right to live; recognise the Divinity within all and the world is ours. Hinduism is not about identity or getting a tattoo to show off at nightclubs…it’s a way of life.
As for Shree Rama eating meat; what a load of rubbish. There is a verse n Valmeeki’s Ramayana that states that Shree Rama abstained from meat and honey.
May 1st, 2007 at 7:50 pm
To all those who justify eating meat by stating Shri Ram’s example, why don’t they go and sleep on the bare floor for the next 14years, wear the bark of a tree for the next 14 years, and roam extensively throughout India by foot for the next 14 years???
Do all this and then harp on about on aspect of Ram’s vanvaas….
May 1st, 2007 at 7:54 pm
Look Nitin, the people u quoted like Srila Prabhupad was a a very immoral and corrupt who created his own version of the Gita WITH many absurditties, which is why ISCKON itself is a con. Gandhi was a sexually preverted traitor. Who use to sleep naked with little girls to see if he would eroused or not.
To quote the likes of him Nitin, puts u in the scum company u deserve to be in. I also know that you and your little group of friends are loser cyber warriors who won’t contribute anyway to the defense of hindus or our dharma.
In fact you and your friends are perfect to become cannon fodder. Such as walking thru landmines to allow for safer passage of the real Hindus behind you.
I ALREADY know i am a better Hindu then the likes of you and I am sure you. I am not going to bend the scriptures. I rather have people like u bent.
Anyway today its time for some nice Haryali chicken.
May 1st, 2007 at 9:56 pm
Quote Makaveli:
“There is no excuse to eat meat except a) ignorance and b) weakness”
So “Makaveli” what are your views on Shivaji and Maharana Pratap? I’ve read a lot about these great characters, and by all accounts they were meat eaters. Who are you to call these people, if it weren’t for whom you wouldn’t even be a Hindu today, ignorant or weak?
As I stated in my original article, I’m a vegetarian, and I think its a good thing to be veggie, but the sheer arrogance of some vegetarian Hindus is outstanding and needs to be exposed for what it is.
May 1st, 2007 at 10:19 pm
Rajesh,
Just like the majority of Hindus these Hindus here haven’t even heard of the Hindu warriors like Shivaji and the many others and dont know anything about their history apart from what their guru or sect tells them which isn’t much apart from following ahimsa and singing bhajans.So that’s why they imagine that Hinduism survived by being peaceful but dont dont know the real truth.
May 1st, 2007 at 10:22 pm
Namaste,
Putting scriptural injunctions aside (which, in my mind, are proof enough), the issue should be easy enough to decide:
1. Under ordinary circumstances, you do not need to consume meat in order to live a perfectly healthy life.
2. If you eat meat under ordinary circumstances, it is because, in one form or another, you derive pleasure from it.
3. In order that you may eat meat, the life of an animal has to be taken prematurely and out of no fault of its own.
Conclusion: By eating meat, you are contributing to the slaughter of another creature for the sole purpose of satisfying a transitory pleasure. Under any other circumstance, this would be called sadism, and should be punishable by law in any civilized country.
With that being said, I do not think it is right to abuse - publicly or otherwise - the meat-eaters among us. After all, it is they who must bear the fruit of their actions. Rather, we should pray that they will learn from their mistakes.
May 1st, 2007 at 11:44 pm
The question has been raised a number of times above regarding whether or not Valmiki Ramayana depicts Rama as eating meat. I personally fail to see how this impacts on the question of whether vegetarianism is or isn’t either (a) desirable, or (b) ‘Hindu’. Dharma, as I have said before, is variable, based on desha, kala and parasthiti (place, time and situation); what was right or wrong for Rama or the people of the Ramayana in Ayodhya (or Chitrakoot, or anywhere else) so many millennia ago may or may not be so for us in Britain today. Personally, I am a strict vegetarian, something that I hold dear; however, I neither condemn nor condone meat-eating for anyone else.
Despite all this, however, since the question of meat-eating in the Ramayana has been raised, it is, I feel, worth considering it, even if only out of sheer academic interest.
One thing that is for certain is that the text has repeated mention of meat-eating, which at the very least demonstrates that it was practiced in ancient Hindu society.
In terms of whether or not Rama himself ate meat, there are a number of verses which mention meat-eating in the specific context of Rama (probably the two most famous examples being Chapter 20 Verse 29 of Ayodhya Kanda, and Chapter 36 Verse 41 of Sundara Kanda). However, there is, in each of these, a certain degree of ambiguity. The question, therefore, remains open to some debate as to whether these verses actually confirm or deny Rama’s vegetarianism.
I myself am certainly no great Sanskrit scholar to suggest that I can definitively resolve these uncertainties and ambiguities where so many great personalities on either side of the debate have failed to come to any conclusion. However, my own personal view is that, taken in context, the meat-eating verses in Valmiki Ramayana actually support the view that Rama did indeed eat meat. I am well aware of the arguments of the likes of Stephen Knapp (which are referred to in a link posted by another learned commentator in the other thread on this topic); however, personally, I feel that when the verse in question is considered in context, his argument falls flat.
I would be happy to discuss my reasoning further in private discussion but feel that this is probably not the forum to delve into any deeper textual analysis on what is at any rate actually nothing more than an interesting tangent from the actual issue at hand.
May 2nd, 2007 at 10:08 am
Dev why don’t you drink? if you eat meat then why not drink…..are you muslim?????
You ARE what YOU EAT !!!!! remember this Dev next time you tuck into your pork chops …pink and sweaty …… I hope in your next life the butcher shows mercy on your squeals as your helpless legs kick for freedom……. You will see others all lined up ready for their fate….
Dev show mercy now……for mankind for animal spirits , for Hinduism.
You are like a brother, Hinduism teaches that we are at differetn levels of understanding….you are at the bottom…..no worry you can still achieve some bliss …read scriptures and worship dieities in their beautiful forms .
jai shaka hari ki
May 2nd, 2007 at 10:10 am
Namaste
I entirely agree with Rajesh. Some of the great people, saviors of Hinduism were nonvegetarrians, like Maha Rana Pratap, Shivaji, Balaji, Subash Chandra Bose, lala lajpat Rai, the list is endless. These were the true sons of Bharat who saved and served Hinduism , along with many vegitarians as well. Moral high ground is not the sole property of vegis like us.
Hitler was a vegi. So it is absurd to divide, to separate good people from bad one based on their dietary or drinking habit.
I am a vegi and proud to be one but I do not considerate myself better or worse than any one, vegi or non vegi. So let us come down from our high horse and be part of the sane group, the good humans.
After all self importance is the worse kind of weakness in human beings.
Bhupendra
May 2nd, 2007 at 1:24 pm
From Nitin Mehta
This chap is abusing Srila Prabhupad whose Hare Krishna movement is the only Hindu missionary movement which has glorified Sanatan Dharma all over the world—they even ditribute the Bhagvad Gita to the people of middle east, ( this is what I call bravery). He abuses Gandhi the father of Indian nation and calls him a traitor—no wonder he is a meat eater. On what grounds can you call Gandhi a traitor—-I know you will say he helped create Pakistan–well no one could have stopped the creation of Pakistan–not even all the meat eating Hindus. Had it not been for the Gandhi and his disciples like Sardar Patel ( vegetarian) India would have been broken into many pieces. So Shivaji was a meat eater—his mother was not and neither was his Guru-the mastermind behind him. Ranapratap’s mother was not a meat eater too and his finanicier without whom he could not have fought the wars was Bhamashah–a Jain. And anyway if the meat eaters were so strong how did they let in the enemies in the first place? Where is the India of meat eaters in the world of sports? From Cricket to Hockey to any other sports the majority of meat eating players fail miserably. Winning wars is not about meat eating–it is about strategy, men, money and luck. It is the Guru of Shivaji who chalked out the strategy for Shivajis victory and it is his vegetarian mother who raised him on the stories of Rama and Krishna ( vegetarians). Subash Chandra Boses army was routed by the British. ( I have the greatest of respect for Subash Bose but meat eaters need take no comfort by giving his example). What are the meat eating Hindus of UK with all their bravery doing to stop the ethnic cleansng of Hindus in Kashmir–sitting here in the comforts of UK –you glorify Shivaji and indulge in meat eating because he did. When it comes to guts and courage–no one can match Gandhi in modern times–he took on the whole empire and inspired the millions of India to wake up. Hindu vegetarians are not pacifists–fight if you must fight your equal–there is no bravery in killing animals –our Ahimsa is Ahimsa towards those who are at our mercy–and it is this sublime moral principle that has kept this religion alive–by abndoning this principle–we are inviting the demise of this great Dharma. Without compassion there is no Dharma–that was the last instruction of Bhisma the wisest of all.
Nitin Mehta
May 2nd, 2007 at 4:07 pm
“The longest living animals are all vegetarians and that include elephants, tortoise and even whales who survive on tiny planktons. Their life span is from 50 to 200 years.”
What the hell are you talking about, all the whale species that I know of eat meat, primarily krill.
What next, you are gonna feed dhal and roti to Lions and Tigers to teach them compassion and increase their life span?
May 2nd, 2007 at 4:13 pm
This not not right guys… If one wants to eat meat, its their free will. They only time you can judge them is when they judge you. Ram ate buffalo, and to eat it, he had to kill it. To eat meat does not make you any less of a Hindu than a vwgitarian. To be an Harijaan in the Hindu caste system, it doesn’t make you any less of a Hindu compared to a Sadhu or Bhramin. You cant treat people differntly or discriminate them because of what they eat. Only if they eat beef should you discriminate them. I am not any less of a Hindu because i eat meat, i however dont eat beef
May 2nd, 2007 at 4:32 pm
Also using such ridiculous logic vegetarians must be weak cuz of their diet since they are usually eaten by predators in the wild, by the same token eating meat must also promote better ability to run bec