Valentines Day Protests in India
Fervent anti-Valentines Day protests are witnessed annually in India, and this year was no exception. Hundreds of protests took place across the country on February 14th against the celebration of Valentines Day.
Valentines cards were burnt, slogans shouted, and in some cases, couples were beaten up who were found making shows of affection that the protesters deemed inappropriate.
February 26th, 2007 at 8:36 am
People should be allowed to show their love for eachother as they wish. It’s the 21st century for God sake. These protests aren’t about inappropriate displays of affection at all, they are about political attempts to gain power and control by using certain groups and protesting on there behaf to gain votes. Showing love for eachother isn’t disgusting, beating up couples on the street is. Maybe people need to start thinking about the positive things in life and start loving eachother more….!
February 26th, 2007 at 9:46 am
Are these people complaining about selling love? What is an arrangeed marriage then? Get into the 21st centrury and stop beating people up in the street who may (or may not even) have a different point of view. Where are the police?
February 26th, 2007 at 1:41 pm
Namaste….
I think the way the media reports valentines day is rather selective. I knew friend of mine who went to India and mentioned to me that some of the valentines day cards being sold were so vulgar that it would not be allowed in some of the typical american stores. So, I think there was this feeling that some pple are taking valentines day overboard. Some choose to protest it and some probably go overboard in the protest.
Nonetheless, the media uses this to do Hindu bashing thru mixing truths with half-truths and lies abt RSS, ABVP, etc. That’s the part we need to be wary of. Falling in love in someone happens to all sorts of pple and I don’t think that is what is being protested. So, I’d be interested to see what is the real story and not what the the perception that the media is trying to create.
Balu
February 26th, 2007 at 1:55 pm
It’s nothing about love or anything, whatever the dominant culture is the people will follow, it’s cool to celebrate Valentines day because they say so on MTV, but I know many Hindus who came to the West from Africa and none of them ever told me about having celebrated any traditional African festivals.
Anyway it’s only the middle and upper classes that celebrate and that too not in the villages where the majority of India still lives.
February 26th, 2007 at 3:32 pm
Dear Hindus , Who on earth are these protesting people ? Are they the custodians of the Hindu faith, does the Hindu faith belong to any one group? For God’s sake Hinduism is a democratic and free for all sane minded peoples of this world , do not talibanise this beautiful libral Dharma of India. Have you seen these protesting goons wearing Hindu dress code (if there is any ), ? They are all in western clothes and not bloody dhoties, probably living in homes furnished with western technology. Are all those kathakaars not commercial franchises, is Ramdev baba not selling his yoga in the west ? Wake up , Hinduism has lasted until now and will last for times to come, valentine or no valentine.
February 26th, 2007 at 6:34 pm
Dear Sirs, This is an extreme of narrow mindedness of those who are the self appointed custodians of the Hindu morality. I do not know what are they objecting to. Is it the Chritian Valentine or is it the expression of love. I do not think anyone in his right mind would object to an espression of love so it must be the Christian saint. So let us change it by calling a more familiar name like MAJNU Day but if it is not acceptable because of its Muslim connections then alternatively indigenous name RANJA of Punjab might foot the bill
Just a thought. Regards Devinder Thakur
February 26th, 2007 at 8:16 pm
my compliments both to Harish and Govinda for giving the protest a context. I believe the Hindus feel a cultural invasion from USA, not unlike the French. The irony is that Hindus acknowledged love to be a potent force long time ago,and even formalized it as the Gandharva Vivah. So it is irritating to say the least when we see people protesting an act of love regardless of its origin. Govinda’s observation is so to the point, look at the protesters, they are all wearing western style clothings. Incidently why denegrate the poor dhoti which is now becoming so irrelevent that even the Bihari Babus ( I am one )do not wear them. However this incident only points out a need on part of the emerging Indian consciousness a need to redefine Indian Identity in the context of Indian culture. I keep wondering what makes one Hindus these days, since we have abandoned the once accpted norms which defined us such as Shikha, the bloody dhoti ( just kidding ), Tilak, daily Karma kand list can go on. Om
February 26th, 2007 at 8:48 pm
Celebrating any festival has to have Purpose, Inspiration and happiness. All of Indian festivals possess those qualities and propel Men’s earthly desires to Spiritual path (Higher order life). As the westernization taking place in India, festivals like Valentine’s day, which has nothing but a single purpose of making love (strictly between male & female, Sex is a synonym with Love in west) and drive mundane passion. However, Commercialism added to such festival is more dangerous. History of this festival has nothing to do with love, except for conducting secret marriages to increase christian population in Pagan Rome.
When a reputed website like you invite public opinion on such sensitive issues, it is your responsibility to give background of it as many dont know anything about it.
Coming to Freedom and Democracy, I too agree that violent protests are absolutely unnecessary and should be ignored. Someone here, commented that Ramdev baba selling yoga in the west and comparing with commercial minded valentine’s day. West has immensily benefited from Yoga and has changed many lives forever and propelled many to search deeper meaning of life. Does valentine’s day changed anyone in India a good humanbeing or any great personality?
Tamasoma Jyotirgamaya…
Dr. P. Joseph, UK.
February 26th, 2007 at 11:55 pm
With all the crap that goes on India, I wish these Hindus would go burn down all the alcohol shops and burn out the drugs, and the high caste people who attack young children because of their caste..western values, it is ‘western values’ which fuel India’s economy.. what next will they do, burn computers?
February 27th, 2007 at 12:34 am
agree with om prakash sharma above, its also refreshing to see the Hindus/muslims and commies agree on something for a change!! incidentally many Hindus in the uk dont actually celebrate this anyway, as Dr. P. Joseph has said above is their any value in this festival?? Does it give any spiritual message thats wortwhile for the people of India?? If your answer is yes than we Hindus are more stupid than i thought.
February 27th, 2007 at 8:12 am
do the hindus know the origins of Valentine day. it has to do with St.Valentine, a chrisitian.
hindus are a copy cat race or we suffer from inferiority complex.i have yet to see the christians celebrating diwali, holi, navratri or any other hindu festivals though they ruled us for 250 years.
February 27th, 2007 at 12:03 pm
I understand those people who protest, as I understand their concerns. I’m not justifying any act of violence or fanaticism, but civic protest is a basic right.
I think those Indians (and more and more people in the non-western world) are afraid of being flooded by consumistic aggression. Consumerism is especially hideous when acting by means of false values. We are witnessing a similar phenomenon in Italy: the so called Halloween day has been imported in our country by the american market as an excuse to sell huge quantities of relateed products and gadgets. The result is that our people are no more celebrating religious festivals, and are attending in mass those phony festivals like Halloween.
February 27th, 2007 at 1:01 pm
“I wish these Hindus would go burn down all the alcohol shops and burn out the drugs”
Alcohol is legal in India except Gujarat, just because you and I don’t drink it and think it’s bad doesn’t give us the right to go burn down the shops.
They don’t like valentines day which you swoon over while you don’t like alcohol, but you find fault with their violent protests while at the same time wishing that they burn down alcohol shops, perfect case of pot calling the kettle black.
“and the high caste people who attack young children because of their caste..western values, it is ‘western values’ which fuel India’s economy”
Actually most of Shiv Sena’s cadre are from Maratha lower castes, it’s progressives like you that think you are fighting for low castes even when we don’t want anything to do with the likes of you, it is mostly the upper and middle classes that celebrate this in the first place, a metal worker in Dharavi has no place or time for such trash.
Maybe you can tell us how “western values” are fueling Indian economy, from what I remember we didn’t have any of these great values back in the day when we owned the largest share of the world economy before the British turned India into a dump.
February 27th, 2007 at 1:16 pm
Dario the point which I have raised again and again and have never gotten an answer is about this, are these people celebrating it for love or because it’s said to be cool to do so TV, we have many Hindus in the West celebrating Christmas and Valentines Day, but you must know that many Hindus arrived in UK from Africa and not directly from India, I have asked several of them if they ever bothered to celebrate any of the traditional African festivals in the countries they lived, an emphatic no is the answer I got every time, now why is that, are black people in Africa not good enough for “integration” or are their festivals not “cool” enough?
You are absolutely right about consumerist aggression, currently American pop culture dominates the world, tomorrow if Italy begins to dominate then these Hindus will dump Valentines and pick up whatever is “cool” then, the least they could do is admit why they are celebrating it when it’s plain obvious that they are following the trend.
But at the same time we have progressives like Rahul Bose who are busy writing about the backwardness of Karva Chauth (festival where married women fast for the health of their husbands).
February 27th, 2007 at 7:45 pm
I don’t understand you people. There is a limit to protest aswell. You just don’t go out in the socitey and protest because people plan to show their love for one another on a specific date. Valentines day, you people are worrying about valentines day, stop worrying about petty issues like this. This issue does not need any concern. Valentines day is not a day that people sell their love.
Is you want to protest, protest about something that actually has some form of concern to India for real. I could give you a few idea’s right now.
Protest about the chaste system. The old tradition that is tearing India apart.
Protest about the Leaders of India. The fact that if you place 5 cores Rs in front of them, they would be prepared to sell you out.
Protest about the fact Hindu’s have very little reconisation in the world. That Hindu’s are not reconzied in a lot of places, where atleast Hinduism should be taught i.e. UK
Protest about those things, things that concern you, not love. Love isn’t forced it just happens. Confession of Love too just happens. Protest about something that concerns MAJORITY of Hindus, and not the minority.
February 27th, 2007 at 10:10 pm
Who are you to tell people on what to protest about (as long as they don’t get violent), in a free society they can protest against what they want as long as they don’t cross the line between freedom of expression and violence.
They do feel that this has relevance to India whether you like it or not, they see it as part of the westernisation and consumerist aggression that is being brought about by Globalisation, if they get violent then the police should intervene.
February 28th, 2007 at 1:40 am
BAN VALENTINES! this is strictly a whitemans “festival”…India and Pakistan have been in the news and always are when 14th feb looms near, and rightly so, I think we can do without this “festival”in the Land of great people such as Lord Ram, Hanumanji, Mahatma Gandhi(not a personal favourite but notheless a great person) stick to what you know, so Hindus its not worth celebrating v’day…
February 28th, 2007 at 8:02 am
Amazing how violent people can be protesting love. Does’t the Guru Gita say the 4 goals of life should be dharma, artha, moksha, and kama?
Does not Hindu mythology celebrate Kama shooting Shiva in the heart so he will love Parvarti? Seems Valentine’s Day must have its origin in Hinduism. What is there to protest?
February 28th, 2007 at 4:20 pm
I don’t know what protesting valentines day have anything to do with being backward. By the what relevance does it have living in the 21st century or 16th century have with any topic. So far the 21st century is all about neo colonialism. Look what the democracies and freedom loving countries
of United States and United Kingdom did to Iraq. I guess thats love too.
All valentines day is, is some commercial holiday and is promoted in India so that many western commercial interests can make money off of it.
2nd you are going to get all these morons who are going to say that people should be allowed to show their love. Screw that, tell them to get a motel. If they can’t afford it or want to show it in the park they deserve to be molested by the public.
Valentines day is also a good time for guys to exploit the situation so they can get sex for free, I mean if you can give out some valentines day cards and box of choclate and get some sex, its cheaper then a prostitute.
It should be promoted as such.
Anyway hopefully in the future we’ll have more people in the streets burning down the stupidity and degrading this holiday and the wannabees the celebrate it in india.
February 28th, 2007 at 8:31 pm
I am of the opinion its commercially driven. Just like Fathers Day, Mothers Day and any other days that will be invented in the future….
Why should the celebration of love be shackled to one day in particular in the gregarian calendar?
Likewise, parents should be given their dues every day, as sanctioned per the scriptures.
Singling out a particular day may serve to weaken bonds that should be ever present.
February 28th, 2007 at 10:18 pm
Its pointless… Why protest something that you know you won’t be able to get rid of? We all know how much it is celebrated. You can protest it, surely protest it, but remeber your wasting your time. I don’t understand you people sometimes. Your telling me that i shouldn’t tell you what to protest. I never did, i said protest something in an area where you NEED to protest. I have to admit, these guys are going overboard now. Don’t tell me, on valentines day, your wives or girlfriends or husbands and boyfriends or whatever, they don’t say happy valentines day, and give you a flower, and say i love you. Dont tell me a single person doesn’t say happy valentines day to you. This day is celebrated everywhere. You can protest it all you want. Protest every year like you’ve been doind for the past few, but remeber, YOU WONT BENEFIT FROM IT. Its way too celebrated to stop it.
It’s like you trying to stop someone celebrating Holi, or Diwali. You can’t stop them, its a day soo well celebrated its literally impossible to stop celebrating it.
Britain ruled over India for nearly 100 years, they ruled there, and left their mark there. Its literally impossible. Open your eyes, think about it
March 1st, 2007 at 12:30 am
“Don’t tell me, on valentines day, your wives or girlfriends or husbands and boyfriends or whatever, they don’t say happy valentines day, and give you a flower, and say i love you. Dont tell me a single person doesn’t say happy valentines day to you.”
Na they don’t man, even if they do I don’t say anything back cuz I don’t care abt it.
“This day is celebrated everywhere.”
Keep living like a frog in the well, go ask any rural Punjabi or Bihari if he celebrates it and you will draw a blank stare.
Even in the cities it’s all the middle class and upper classes that do it, go down to Dharavi or Jogeshwari in Mumbai and see if they celebrate it.
You can celebrate it if you want, but face it not all of us wanna follow the latest trash from the West.
March 1st, 2007 at 6:20 pm
im sorry, let me remind you, i did not say that you MUST follow it, i said its a waste of time protesting it. I have no objection if you don’t want to celebrate it. Let me tell you something, I don’t excally know about you, but I live in the west. Im purely proud of being a Hindu, and a Gujrati, but im not prepared to make myself an outcaste. Im in school, high school, and here, it matters to people when you don’t join in. People would be rude to you and stuff like that. I’m proud of being a Hindu soo much, no one dares to say anything about Hinduism when im around, otherwise i garantee their head will come off their shoulders.
Im a proud Hindu, I played my part being a loyal Hindu, but i won’t play the part of being a Hindu that just doesn’t broaden their mind whilst being in High school. In my school we have to be part of these celebrations, but what we celebrate are not all western things. Me and a group of friends arranged a celebration for Diwali, and even the Kala’s and Gora’s joined in, everyone did. So i personally don’t think i am being western, I feel I’m being fair.
I live in UK, I am fair to the British people, I celebrate their celebrations, they celebrate mines. I choose to follow the latest trash from the west, because I was born here in London, I’m studying here, I’m spending my childhood here, in UK. If i want to grow up here, Im going to have to respect the British celebrations, and seeing as I was born here, I grew up joining in the celebrations, so i intend to continue. Not all of western celebrations are trash, dedicating a day to love, to your mothers, to your fathers. What is so trash about that?
March 1st, 2007 at 9:36 pm
well here we go again lots of people getting hot under the collar over bunch of buffons in some far off land no one cares about anyway and which is idealised at this saintly place as long as these beastly foreigners (please add your own hated minority here) were not there spoiling it for us all.
tell you what what don’t we
1, Protest against the Protesters for Protesting againsts stuff that is not worth protesting about anyway…
or
2, Nuke the whole place and start again.
this is of course only my opinion, I could be wrong.
to all you, my dear valentines and prem sathi’s
xxxxx
JB
March 1st, 2007 at 9:54 pm
You can celebrate it if u want, then why r u upset that people who were born in India, grew up their entire life in India want to protest against it being celebrated in India, Brits would start protesting too if all the Hindus in London began to blast off loud crackers on Diwali, holding a massive Ganesh procession through the streets every year for immersion like they do in India.
I live in Toronto, no one gives a poop if u celebrate valentines day or not, actually I am in uni right now, no one I know said anything about V.Day, sure they might talk about it if others bring it up, but neither did I bring it up nor did they, if they think thats rude then they can f off.
Tha trashy thing about it is that it’s just another excuse for middle and upper classes wannabe’s in India to show off how progressive they are, has nothing to do with the underlying message of love, if Hindus were so concerned about being rude the one’s in Africa would have dressed up in traditional African clothes and celebrated atleast some of their traditional festivals none of which they did, but soon as they land in the West they start talking about integration, openmindedness and poop to cover up their own inferiority complex.
You don’t see Hindus in Malaysia celebrating Bakrid do you or the Hindus in Gulf celebrating Muhammad’s birthday, something to think about.
March 1st, 2007 at 10:26 pm
To be honest Sejal u don’t have to celebrate anything you don’t want to. They can’t make you an outcaste. Actually what i noticed about gorehs, is if you try to be a wannabee they will outcaste you and if you r different and on the defensive they will do the same. On the other hand if you r a politically incorrect and vulgur they will like u. See when goreh or kalu ask me about eating cows and what I would do if there was not other food available, I just told them I would yet gorehs and after that they were really cool with me. I didn’t go and bendover so that i could go celebrate xmas.
2nd I am taxpayer and I don’t care what anyone says no one can force me to do anything. Besides on valentines day in the west I would send some cards and choclate if it got me to score.
But in India its a differents story, if you can burn down enough stores and molest enough couples you can pretty much assure its destruction.
March 2nd, 2007 at 2:58 pm
Haribol
Thankyou Prak ….Yeah you seem to have got what I am talking about. I am not upset that people in India who grew up there are protesting it. I am upset that they are soon going to bring pure destruction there for a stupid reason.
I am growing up in a goreh’s socitey, I don’t force myself to celebrate these occasions. I prefer to do so, because i have been since my younger days.
Harish, As far as malasyia is concerned, we are in a total differnt socitey, i am talking about a total differnt socitey, i don’t know how life there is like, but i know that that is them, and this is us.
Park I dont go crazy and do everything these goreh and Kalas tell me to do. I do as i Wish on my own will. I don’t know about all of you out there, but i do as i wish, and i do not let anyone rule over me.
These gorehs and kalas, as far as they are concerned, i don’t spend my entire school day with them, I spend my lunch and break with apna people. I don’t restrict myself to be with them. Infact i think i restrict myself NOT to be with them
What do you think?
Jai Hind
March 2nd, 2007 at 6:28 pm
the important thing is to associate with clued up people with similar values, not necessarily sticking just to indians…u would limit ur interactive experience then, and cut off other sources of learning/perspective..aim to mix freely without diluting/hiding anything u believe in…..u would be surprised i’ve met quite a few gorah and kala that know more about vedic culture then most indians !! so dangerous to categorise according to skin colour, go a bit deeper if u can, i.e identify what philosophy/values ur associates share etc…
March 2nd, 2007 at 6:39 pm
Haribol,
i hear what u sayin Sejal, i think most of us can empathise with you…..bear in mind one thing (probably be more useful when u leave the school environment)
its dangerous to assume most hindus u meet to know/care about their dharma/faith/history etc..
in a similar way its wrong to assume your vedic knowledge cannot be enriched by a white or black person who shares similar values/ideals & philosophies….they do exist!
knowledge aint restricted by race
March 2nd, 2007 at 10:50 pm
Haribol
Rakeshji, you have misunderstood my reply. I mean to say, kala’s and goreh’s are my friends, but i tend to hang around with asians more than them. Asains, in the asian socitey, i do not sort of discriminate people by their race. I choose my friends in the asain socitey by their personalities, weather i can trust them or not, and weather they can trust me or not. I choose my friends through loyalty, and the people who make me laugh, pick me up when im down, stick up for me when im in a fight, these are the people i prefer to be with. I don’t choose my friends by race or colour. It just happens by co-incidence that most of them are asain of some sort. 90% of them i gess.
Rakeshji, don’t worry. I am a truely proud Hindu, nothing, and i mean NOTHING of my religion is diluted or hidden from anyone. People ask me questions, happily i answer them. A friend of mines asked me today, why dos ganeshji have a elephany head?. She listened with respect. I explained to her about Shiv and Parvati, and the whole story. Rakeshji, i have total respect and a LOUD, PROUD dedication to my religion. I find in a lot of matters, me being a Hindu, me being a Hindu is actually my motivation. I solve moral and ethical issues, using the teachings of Hinduism. I grew up with a lot of dedication to various gods. And today, i learnt the teachings of several, and use it to guide me through my day to day life. Being a teenage 13 year old doesn’t restrict me. I am prepared to give my life for my religion, people, and country. I cannot explain my proudness of India, and being a Hindu. You have to see it. Try and find the meaning and feelings behind these words.
Rakeshji, a friend of my, Hindu, she hates all these talks about our culture dharma ect, but she has immense passion for our country. She doesn’t care about anything really. She tells me that i am crazy to get involved like this, you know, in disscussions such as this one at such a young age. I told her, No one person is too young or too old to join their community. Did i say wrong?… you see, i realise the situation you are talking about. The situation you talk about, leaves us to thinking back to our own people. I feel kind of, unique i gess would be the word to use.
Not a lot of Hindu’s in our socitey, here in London, actually care about the Hindu sociyet. They go garba, play dhandiya, join in celebrations ect, but their dedication to our religion isn’t there. I realise what you say.
Rakeshji, on your last statement, you have my full belief in it. I know and understand, the fact that knowledge is not restricted by race. However, i want to ask you something in relation to that. Today in the news, BBC news, i saw a documentary on the subject, Black Students and consistantly discriminated, for being black really.
In the report, it says about how Black students get less respect of all sorts. I am in a secondary school, the age group the documentary was talking about. What they said, however was true. The 6 black students in my class, are told off once a day by a primary or senior member of staff, and once a week sent to he headmaster, for something that doesn’t involve them. Would you agree with me, that gorehs are racially abusive towards black people? The black people who are kept out of lessons for something that is not even their fault, they loose their education because they are not permitted to go to their regular classes and hear the teachers lectures. would you call this restriction because of race? i personally would call it their education is restricted because of their race.
Looking forwards to hearing your opinion Rakeshji. I wish to see the wider eye in what you are trying to say.
Jai Hind
March 3rd, 2007 at 2:58 am
sejal….you claim to be a proud Hindu yet you fear to be an outcaste in Britain and you care that you have to “fit in” to what others do at school etc….seems youre not as confident in your Hindu skin as you make out. If you were, the last think on your mind would be the fear of fitting in. I live in the UK too…outcaste?..yep, i am. Proud of being an outcaste?..damn right!..why?…cos Im Hindu..I follow Sanatan Dharma..im different to the gorias..its a simple fact. Wen its diwali, i give diwali cards to my white mates…when India and England play cricket I openly refer to “our team” as the Indian team, even when surrounded by English people. For me to be a Hindu in UK, I MUST be an outcaste by definition.
Harrish…for me, you hit the nail on the head…Hindus in India dont celebrate valentines day as a day of love. Its celebrated because it is seen as “cool”. I had many friends at Uni who were from India…mostly Mumbai…the “eilte of Indian society”…the “absolutely cool mumai-ites..yaar” (their words not mine). The were the least likely to come to University Hindu events, the most likely to SHUN Hinduism, the most likely to ape anything and everything thats western. The girls from India were the sluttiest…the guys were the sleaziest and all had utter disregard for being Hindu. But hey, wen it was xmas and valentines day, PARTY Galore!!!!!….they would celebrate the birth of jesus and rejoice!!!…and share love and good feelings….um….yeah, whatever….!..they were trying to fit in. And to ne honest, they looked stupid. I remember reading an article about how Indians form Indian are treated wen they come to the UK by british asians…Its reason as mentioned above…the absolute apeing of western culture that annoys many of us.
anyways…if Hindus want to celebrate love…then do so…do it on any random day in the year…do it everyday..all the time (or never if youre a weirdo), but dont blindly do it on a day were christians and those with hidden agendas will earn a mighty buck…dont do it at the expense of your own traditions..and dont do it cos its cool…because, thats…well….NOT cool. Thats pretty sad.
March 3rd, 2007 at 6:52 am
There are a lot of people here sayin that Valentines day is a ‘Christian thing’…but in fact it is not. It lost anything more than a vague connection with religion long time ago, and is just a random celebration like Mother’s Day.
Anyone who wants to celebrate it should be allowed to do so in any country without anyone giving them any country.
March 3rd, 2007 at 9:31 am
whilst some of the indians….whoops there i go again …..i should say Hindus (have to differntiate really cos theres a divergence between india and hindu thats growing all the time), i met at Uni were humble, sincere and cultured the vast majority (stemming from a loaded Mumbai/Delhi background) were exactly as Db8 described, it was a shock to my system to see how they carried themselves. Pathetic ! Ironically, they will be groomed as the next generation of leaders.
March 3rd, 2007 at 9:47 am
Sejal,
I never would have guessed you were only 13, your well mature for your age in what you have to say. So respect there. A few thoughts:
Its natural to have more hindu/sikh friends cos we have more in common with them. Gets trickier when you try and go beyond bollywood, garba, gandhi and the indian cricket team tho…
You shouldnt feel you have to prove your hindu-ness to anyone, including me. It sounds like you certainly live it.
As to educating others, its OK to share knowldege etc.. but in my opinion its nots worth sharing certain types of knowledge with undeserving, insincere people who are not genuine seekers of the truth of the matter….it wastes your time and you know what they say about knowledge in the wrong hands..
As for discrimination against black students, it don’t surprise me. Its unfortunate. Theres a stereotype there and sometime innocents get plunged into a “potentail trouble-maker” category. Its up to them to challenge this if they are innocent. If you are required to, you could back their innocence if the issue became seriously elevated. They have to themselves value their education for any help to be effective.
March 3rd, 2007 at 12:10 pm
Sejal…youre merely 13 years old, and yet you write with such passion and zeal. Im quiet a bit older than you..im 22. Its funny, the very first post you wrote, I immediatley new you were from London (im from Birmingham) but I would never have guessed your age.
Youre right, youre never too young or too old to get involved in getting to know about our dharma on a deeper level. Participating in discussions such as these is nothing but constructive. Sure there will be clashes of opinion, but overall, if you can learn something, if you can enhance your knowldege on dharma, if you are encouraged to open your eyes that little further to a different perspective, then you are in a much better position to spread the message of sanatan dharma.
Respect to you.
BTW, with regards to black people and discrimination…i tend to have a different opinion based upon experience. I noticed that black people in this country are stigmatised as being violent..scary..witha lack of desire to follow rules. and in most cases that I have seen (I have many black friends) this is true!..even my black friends joke about how no other black person they know like being told what to do. You could call it a self fulfilling prophecy. They are EXPECTED to be full of bad attitude and be ultra aggressive and strong..so it has got to the point that to be a true black person, you must have these qualities. If not, you arent black. And OTHER black people will make fun of you. You must admit, the thought of a black guy who can play the violin and who is soft in nature…goes against the grain of what a black person is SUPPOSED (stereotypically) to be. and I think its gone to their head. Much in the same way that Punjabis who dislike the taste of drink, feel they MUST drink, because “im punjabi, thats what we do, we get pissed and we love our sharaabi”.
March 3rd, 2007 at 1:33 pm
“Being a teenage 13 year old doesn’t restrict me.”
Props for u, u r right it shouldn’t restrict u, good to see u taking interest in dharma at such a young age when so many adult Hindus are clueless.
In all the other communities, kids are atleast taught the basics of their religion at a young age, in our community we are taught that “u have to become a doctor/engineer and earn a lot of money bla bla bla”, so no wonder ur friend feels that way, because the community itself is directionless, she probably picked up the same attitude from her parents or someone she knew, very rarely do people get out of parental conditioning (i am one who managed to do it) and take an interest in dharma.
March 4th, 2007 at 1:01 am
Haribol
Db8, Yes, I claim to be a proud Hindu, I KNOW I am a proud Hindu. Even then, Db8, you cannot deny, I am not alone when I admit yes, I partially fear rejection and negeltance from friends and from the local socitey, But tell me someone, who at not one point in their life thought, Oh my god, I think im alone in this. I have no support.
I stopped fearing this now, because after getting to know people in my school in South West London, I made friends with a group of people who i trust will never, and never means never leave my side. If you say something to me, before me, your going to have to answer all of them. You say something to them, your going to have to answer me first. The bond of friendship we have made is such, it allows me to be proud of my Religion, and to have the loyal friends that I wished for.
When I said to let them celebrate it, I meant let them celebrate it if they are doing it for the meaning of the day, not to seem’cool’. You never know, there must be atleast 1000 people who celebrate valentines day, the way its suppose to be done, for the MEANING of the day.
what you said is true too. Celebrate it everyday, not just on this one day, because the Westerns do it. However, Valentines day is a day that could pursuade one to express their love.
Manishji, that you. Yes, mother’s day, a day dedicated to mothers. Valentines day, a day dedicated to love.
Rakeshji, I agree with you by all means. If they celebrated Valentines day becuase it seems ‘cool’, they need to be taught a lesson of some sort.
At the age of 5, I grew up with Hindu minded people who gave me the realisation that there is a lot more to Hinduism than, Holi, Diwali Raksha Bhandan ect. They taught me there is a lot more to India than its heat, Love, Land, and Dharma. They made me realise a lot, since the age of about 10, I knew I was old enough to understand a fair bit. I started to look deeper into our Dharma around then. Since I have been researching out Religions, issues on the news. India’s importance to me increases as the days go by, because i understand India and Hinduism more.
You are right, Sharing knowledge is only good when theknowledge is for a good cause. Not if it is going to waste.
Db8, Thank you, I write with passion, for India, but my Inspiration comes from my belief. Harishji, again, thank you to. Being a child, even though i know that to get my voice heard alot, it takes a lot of enegy, im prepared for it, if it means my knowledge on Hinduism expands.
My whole point in this disscussion was, there is a meaning to Valentines day, the meaning is love. Love yes, love IS divine, its a God Given right to us, don’t abuse it, but don’t be selfish on it either. Jai Hind
March 4th, 2007 at 4:04 pm
Db8
Great response. The problem is not the celebration of love, but rather following a festival because it’s cool. If you’re truly in love (be it with a partner, wife, mum, dad, bro, sis whatever) this love should be expressed every day. Why choose one day to express this love?
The trouble is that it is more a celebration of lust and is celebrated by Hindu youths as it is ‘cool’.
In this Kali Yuga, adhering to Dharma will not always win you friends and may even outcaste you. I know because I don’t go out to pubs/clubs and get drunk with my ‘Hindu’ friends. In fact in all my life, the most intolerant people I have met regarding Dharma and righteous living have been ‘Hindus’. Yet I’m proud to say that I never have nor never will sacrifice my faith to win ‘friends’. Be true to yourself and Dharma.
March 7th, 2007 at 5:04 pm
celebrate life every day.
Let’s admit it, we are all to a large degree ignorant. As such we all suffer to a substantial degree. Thus if we need to celebrate life and the positives to keep us going on the path to Brahman, this is a good.
Take any excuse to celebrate life, for gods sake!
But clearly hedonism has its problems. And a disciplined life is the source of Yoga (translate to religion - to tie / ligate).
Further, culture is very important as a kind of backdrop that illuminates the paths to truth. No backdrop is necessarily better but clearly ahimsa, karma, gyana… tend to create a more peaceful and cooperative (satsang) process. Thus defending culture is important. But hatred is not a part of hindu dharma (though certainly a part of the hindu landscape).
As to valentines, I have seen some of the stuff that comes out of India and it would not be allowed in the US. People here would protest that stuff and get people who promoted it thrown out of their churchs, communities, etc. Valentines is much like life in this way: if you want it to be about lust you can make it so, if you want it to be about divine love you can make it so. Now commerce will go to the basest (widest group of purchasers). So don’t be surprised if it does so. (that does not mean to let in to it). The protestors, further, are trying to defend their construct of what Hindu culture is, the promoters are trying to make a buck (rupee), and the christians are trying to destroy hindu culture. None of these can be reasonably debated.
In the midst of complexity is the individual soul making the choices that make it awesome.
Sejal, and other kids out there, Go Girl! Delve deeper into the truth for the truth is only for you, tat tvam asi.
hariaum
March 8th, 2007 at 4:47 pm
Haribol
Navinji, you spoke the truth. We need to enjoy life, we shouldn’t waste it our time. The time that goes, it will never come back. The path to the truth is illuminated by culture. I couldn’t phrase that any better. We need to agree on something. What our people do in our Country, i know they are doing it for the good of the country, but beating people up wasn’t the answer. Protesting is good, but yet, there are many things we could protest.
The truth about the Police System in India being corrupt has finally come out. It’s on the news now, I think we should do something. This is definatly an issue that is worth argueing. The Police take bribes, meaning, their honesty isn’t fair.
Same is about Valentines day, Honesty on Valentines day is the only Right thing. If your celebrating it for the wrong reasons, your dishonest, and correct me if im wrong, but Honesty, and our reputation means alot in our Country, and to our people.
Whatever we do, our Reputation follows us. If your dishonest about this, then how can you be truthful about something big in life?
Navinji, thank you, funny enough, I have to be honest, since i have joined this debate, I realise that I have been taking more intrest in this situation, and in other situations in India. I will Navinji, I promise every Hindu out there, Im here to find the truth, I wont leave here until I find the truth.
Jai Hind
March 27th, 2007 at 4:51 am
It warmed my heart to see this free expression of thoughts, feelings and openions. May I add that ability and right to question any belief is fundamental to being a Hindu, that even includes questioning the very notion of God Hood. Long ago our ancestors declared ” veer vogya vasundhara “. Only fearful and timid of hearts fear celebration what ever its source. How can one claim to be a Hindu and be afraid of whatever other cultures have to offer. Does any one really believe that Hindus were able to absorve the affects of greeks, kushans, huns,and suks without accepting their cultural differences. Those of us who live in western countries have experienced the question of ethinicity,and identity. I believe challange may be to develop a deeper sense of identity based upon inner convictions and ability to accept beauty where ever one may find it. I have had great time celebrating valentine’s day & christmas and my christian friends celebrate holi and diwali with us. Are we not all ambasdors of our convictions? How come we not able to accept to see the harmony of opposites, when we live every second in it. It is curious to observe hostility towards Valentine’s day in India and the over seas community when movies coming out of Mumby is constantly playing that theme.om
June 25th, 2007 at 9:23 am
Recent research done by me has proven that valentines day originally was formed in india, and continued by british after their rule in indis. I suggest you all calm down now, as it is originally our function, and love is divine I know, but somehting started by us, should continue.
Jai Hind
June 25th, 2007 at 6:30 pm
maybe u can share this recent research with us then?
June 25th, 2007 at 8:27 pm
Not-withstanding, what nonsense you’ve been told by the media, the truth is
that the Valentine Day was originated in India, and to top it, in Gujarat -
a state of Mahatma Gandhi who preached love, peace and non-violence.
Read further for the facts that have been hidden from the pages of history
so far. Here it is:
Well, it is well known what the people in Gujarat are like, especially the
Patel men folk. It is a known fact that they (Patels) don’t treat the
opposite sex (their Patalanis) with respect; some of the firebrand members
of the opposite sex (wives) thought they deserved better.
One fine day, one brave Patalani (Patel lady - her name is unfortunately
lost in oblivion), had enough of “Atyachar”(Torture) perpetrated on her, by
her husband, and then she finally chose to rebel by beating up her husband
with a Velan…Yeah, the same Velan with which she made chapattis for him
everyday; only this time, instead of the dough, it was the husband who was
flattened like a chapatti, albeit an oblong one. This was a momentous
occasion for all the Gujarati women and a revolt soon spread, like a wild
fire, with several housewives beating up their, bad as well as good,
husbands with Velan; and there was an outburst of moaning chapattis all over
Anand and Ahmedabad.
The Patel men folk learnt their lesson and behaved a bit better with their
Patalani partners. However, there was no putting down the burgeoning
feminist spirit of the times, and the beatings continued incessantly.
Eventually the Patel Men-folk started improving and the frequency of the
beating was reduced to once a month -usually towards the middle of the
month, so that they would remain “disciplined”.
Further improvement in the Patel men-folk reduced the need to more of an
annual ritual, to ensure that the Patlanis can demonstrate the “Credible
Threat”; least the men-folk forget and get back to their olden ways. And so
each year that day (Middle of February, i.e.,14th) the womenfolk, if only
gingerly and lovingly, as a token gesture, beat up their husbands to
commemorate that eventful day, which had contributed substantially to better
their lot.
The men folk also submitted to this, in good humor, since they didn’t really
get beaten up other days of the year. The entire ritual soon became a caring
and loving affair, with wives having the satisfaction of beating up their
husbands, their husbands cringing in mock fear and pain, and the guys having
the supreme joy of submitting to the whims of the women they loved.
This custom continued for many years, even when the British occupied India.
As Gujarat fell more and more under the influence of Western Culture and
language, some of the more fashionable and educated women, sometimes wearing
leather boots and clothes (this even created a fad for leather Velans for a
short time, but it soon passed, as they could not use them to make
chapattis) on that day appeared with a Velan in hand, and called out to
their husbands “Velan time” before starting off.
The British noticed this, and they were quite amused and endeared by the
peculiar ritual. They also saw it for what it really was, i.e. a
manifestation of love, not of hate. The ritual soon spread to Britain and
many other Western countries, specifically, the catch words “Velan time” Of
course in their foreign mouths, it was bastardized to “Velan tine” and then
to “Velantine”. And from that day onwards, 14th of February, since it was
indeed that day that 400 years ago an irate Gujarati Patalani housewife
nearly committed manslaughter, came to be known as Valentine’s Day. The
custom of hitting with Velans died a natural death as more modern (and
lethal) equipment was made available to Gujju Girls with the advent of time
and technology, but 14th of Feb still stands as a symbol of undying and
universal love.
This is the truth of valentines day. Do you yet still object it?
June 25th, 2007 at 9:01 pm
This is unbelievable. Valentines day is a beautiful day where young people of any faith who are in love, whether married or courting, simply celebrate the beauty of their feelings for each other, exchange cards & gifts, and have a great party. Its a joyous celebration of love - what’s wrong with that I wonder.
Does it matter then where this tradition originated from? Its universal, and its nobody elses business except that of the people who celebrate the occasion. How does one explain that to the protesters?
June 26th, 2007 at 4:44 pm
Actually Sejal besides a couple of net forums I don’t see any proof for this story and Valentine’s Day as a word is mentioned in Shakespeare’s Hamlet much before the British had any largescale contact with Gujaratis, to me it seems like one of the numerous crackpot stories that people with too much time on their hands cook up and other gullible people believe.
June 28th, 2007 at 5:17 pm
Harish, what you say may be true, but this story seems highly believeable. Dont tell me that the British woke up on the 14th febuary many years ago, and decided to call it valentines day, and love their girlfriends/wives and give them a treat on this day. The story had a sense of meaning, it speaks a lot of truth, and it seems to make sense. Try thinking on it. It may change your idea/mind
June 28th, 2007 at 8:00 pm
sorry to me it seems total nonsense and to top it all off no sources are quoted to back up this weirdo story, so i count it as another crackpot story on par with PN Oak’s nonsense.
July 1st, 2007 at 5:20 pm
well, harish it isnt about being able to back it up. Its about belief. Its a matter of what you believe. This explaination seems highly believeable, and i trust its true. I know it cannot be entirely the whole truth, yet I believe some aspects of this theory must be true. Not all off it could have been some mythical dream made by someone who was bored and decided to post a made up story to make people get excited. If you get what I mean.